Movie Moan - As Geek As It Gets
Mon, July 30, 2012 Your regular Movie Moan is a day early this week. You're welcome!
To give you a heads up, the video version of the show isn't the usual visual spectacular with gimmicks and jokes, simply because it doesn't need to be. We have a crammed, passion filled show for you to follow on from last week's Batman special in which we exclusively discuss the future of the character, and indeed the entire DC Universe on film. This, of course, finally means tackling the teaser trailer for the new Superman film, and blows will be exchanged on that particular subject I can tell you.
Jamie and Phil are joined, just like last week, by Capt. Ed Hocken, Justin Korthof, and the boss himself Peter Georgiou:
2:35 mins - Is 'The Dark Knight Rises' the 'Return Of The Jedi' of Batman movies?
7:40 mins - 'Justice League: The Movie' - now or later? With or without Batman?
19:15 mins - If Batman stays solo, should they start from scratch, continue with the Nolan continuity, or something in-between?
36:45 mins - Justin vs. The Legion Of Moaners on the subject of the 'Man Of Steel' teaser trailer.
58:45 mins - Green Lantern - what the hell are we going to do with you?
67:45 mins - 'The Flash' and 'Wonder Woman' could be great movies.
72:50 mins - The best way for the DC film universe to unfold.
Download the audio only MP3 version right here:
Reader Comments (5)
Once again, a great podcast gentlemen.
I agree with Jamie's comparison of TDKR and RotJ only that I find TDKR more enjoyable with additional viewings. It's a fair assessment though, how in the hell can you top Empire Strikes Back and TDK?
If WB is serious about a JL movie it has to have the story in order first. As much as I enjoyed the Avengers, I couldn't care less about the paper thin characters or the lazy plot laid out in the movie. I actually cringe watching the commercials for the upcoming blu-ray because I know how much it'll really get picked apart now that the honeymoon phase is over now. Back to JL, these are characters that need an internal conflict like Identity Crisis to really delve in to how the team comes together or falls apart.
If they can't give adequate time to flesh out these characters equally or give them interesting arcs then just give the public what they want in a Batman/Superman outing.
They gotta go with a reboot, NO Origin story though, instead of continuing the Nolanverse. Let's face it, there are some that liked the John Blake arc but to go in that direction is a waiting failure. A Bruce Wayne-less John Blake Batman film isn't going to sell tickets like a Bruce Wayne Batman film would. Start fresh and do what Nolan did in first incorporating villains that haven't been used recently like Black Mask, Hugo Strange, Oswald Cobblepott, Edward Nashton/Nygma, etc. They've got to take it to another direction as well. Don't be afraid of including some of the fantastical elements that the Nolan films took out. Just don't overboard with it like Burton (Returns) did.
I literally don't have a side to pick on the Man of Steel debate because of the several factors here. I'd argue that the teaser shown in theaters was enough to start chatter since we have a full year till the thing comes out. However, it wouldn't be much of a debate if only Snyder didn't show that incredible trailer at comic-con. THAT had all the elements of a great teaser. A serious take on the Man of Steel's psyche, action shots, fantastic score by Zimmer's catalogue. I still think it was a great teaser that promised to show us who Clark Kent is instead of glamour shots of Supes in action.
I don't have kind words for Green Lantern so I'll just skip it.
I think Wonder Woman is an intriguing property to incorporate as a character study, but again like most DC characters everyone knows their name but don't know WHO they are other than Batman. Her origin story also delves too much into Greek mythos and makes her difficult to relate to. The Flash is one of the hardest because all he is is a speedster. There's nothing particularly interesting about him other than he can run fast and cracks wise (West)
Always enjoy listening to you guys, keep up the good work.
fantastic podcast. great that Peter was back.
Excellent discussion. And Justine's passion for comics really energized the talk.
As for the Superman teaser, to my mind the studio had only one agenda; get people talking about Superman. The only bad press is no press. WB does not care at this point if the talk is good, bad, or indifferent. They just want to put out in the public's conscious that a new Supe movie is on the way.
And they have accomplished that.
And the reactions to this one will be instantly forgotten by the fans if the next one kicks butt. The general public has already forgotten the contents of this one. But they are now aware that the Cape is making a return.
Great podcast as always.
I think what Warners is going to do is pretty obvious. They're going to sit on any announcement for another Batman movie or a JL film until at least March 2013. Why? Because they want TDKR to compete at the Oscars. If they even stand a chance to get a token Best PIcture nomination, they will not try to make TDKR look like a film on an assembly line of tent pole films for the studio. Granted, if they find out it doesn't get the nomination (likely) in January, that may change things. Still, I think they'll wait even longer until they see what MOS does because....
If MOS does well, they'll fast track the JL movie and get it done with Henry Cavill and a slew of characters we haven't seen (Wonder Woman, Flash) and those we have, but in rebooted form (Batman, Green Lantern) by 2016 at the latest. If MOS underperforms, they'll likely get gun shy again and go back to a new Batman reboot which I think could be very similar to the Arkham games that are popular right now (an established Batman fighting supernatural and gritty villains alike with a full bat-family). That or after the tragic shooting, they tone it down to Brave and the Bold fare, but I doubt they'd do that.
What I think they should do is just copy Marvel's layout but be more ambitious in the products. Get a MOS and MOS2 done and in the same time do Wonder Woman and Flash right and build that to JL Just make it more ambitious than the happy meals of the MCU.. But Avengers is obviously the hottest type of superhero movie right now (Marvel is even aping themselves with the awful-sounding "Galaxy Guardians" movie), so JL will com first.
Lastly, my two cents on the MOS trailer: I thought it was fine. It didn't blow me away, but I thought it was a better announcement than SR's teaser which I only vaguely remember thinking, "That's it?" Granted, other than Batman, I don't care about the DC universe that much, so I haven't seen the comic-con stuff. So, the Jor-El trailer worked for me because I liked Russell Crowe's melodic narration and the use of LOTR music (who cares what scene it's from?). Most of all the trailer didn't evoke SR to me, but rather "Batman Begins." Hence, attaching it to TDKR. It felt very much like it could be in Nolan's world after Bruce Wayne retires. Clark fishing off the coast of Alaska and being lost feels like how Nolan depicted Bruce Wayne spending his 20s (drifting in angst and confusion). They even made sure they got Nolan and "The Dark Knight Trilogy" in the trailer. I think it piques interest for the non-fans like myself. It will be up to future marketing to build the hype.
This was the geekiest Movie Moan I can remember :) (I say that with love). Whatever W.B. does with these characters, they can't drag their heels, because IMO the superhero movie bubble won't last forever. It will eventually pop. Then again, as mentioned in the Podcast, WB can only make so many superhero movies each year. Plus, DC characters are inherently more difficult to film than Marvel. WB is stuck between a rock and a hard place. How best to approach making movies out of DC intellectual property sure is a tough nut to crack, no doubt. For now, I'll think modestly like Jamie and just hope Man of Steel is good. If it's bad and does disappointing business, then what does it matter if WB already has plans for the wider gallery of DC characters. Superman is the most famous superhero character of all, and they can't strike out twice with him. Plus it would make other lesser-known DC character movies dead on arrival. Let's face it, the Nolan Batmans have given WB momentum with DC movies, but not much else has. They need to continue building momentum if they desire to continue building out the DC movie universe. That's why I think it's smart for them to just focus on getting Man of Steel perfect. Then again, there's that belief in the back of my mind that the superhero bubble is bound to pop at some point, so... it's a tough call.